circular polarizer

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circular polarizer

Postby Slaggie on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:05 pm

In reading a photographers website I saw this comment about Nikon autofocus cameras having trouble with linear polarizers. Nikon uses a partial mirror system for autofocus plus matrix and spot metering . The article claims that under certain lighting conditions, linear polarizers interfere with these automatic systems. The results of interference are, slower than normal focusing, incorrect focusing, and/or incorrect exposure.The fix is to use a Nikon circular polarizer. Now; I like to use a polarizer and am wondering about the effect of the filter on a photo. You cant rotate the filter to get the effect you want, bummer. I suppose these Nikon filters are quite expensive, more bummer.
Does this really have these effects? Or does everybody already know this and I am only now seeing this as this will be my first Nikon?
Geo. :-?
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Postby birddog114 on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:08 pm

Here's the thread we've just discussed few weeks ago:
http://forum.d70users.com/viewtopic.php ... r+circular
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Postby Glen on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:09 pm

I thought all autofucus SLR's had this problem not just Nikon?
Last edited by Glen on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby sirhc55 on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:10 pm

Slaggie - you can rotate a circular polariser no problem to get the effect you want. They can be expensive depending on which make you go for.
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Postby stubbsy on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:11 pm

Slaggie

The article is correct in all but one aspect. Yes you need a circular polarizer (CP), but NO it doesn't have to be a Nikon one, rather it has to be one that fits a Nikon lens.

Basically there are a number of manufacturers of CP filters that fit Nikon lenses (I and many others here use Hoya). You either get a CP for your lens size (eg 67mm for the kit lens, 77mm for the 70-200 VR etc) OR you buy the largest size CP you'll need (probably the 77mm) and buy step up rings that convert your lens from say 67mm to 77mm.
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Postby huynhie on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:12 pm

Glen,

you are correct, all autofocus cameras should be using Circular Polarisers
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Postby stubbsy on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:13 pm

Wow

Question asked at 12:05

5 Answers by 12:12

Gotta love this place :D
Last edited by stubbsy on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Glen on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:13 pm

Thanks Huynhie
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Postby huynhie on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:18 pm

Slaggie,

Circular polariser are more expensive then normal filters, my Nikon 77mm circlular polariser cost me approx AUS230 imported from Hongkong.

If you buy it in Australia you are looking at over AUD300
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Postby Slaggie on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:18 pm

Gad, you guys are FAST! Ok, got that, just johnny come lately. Thanks. Leaves a question, You can rotate a circular polarizer and change the polarizing effect? If you can, and use any brand, then is indeed good news. Geo. :D
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Postby birddog114 on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:22 pm

huynhie wrote:Slaggie,

Circular polariser are more expensive then normal filters, my Nikon 77mm circlular polariser cost me approx AUS230 imported from Hongkong.

If you buy it in Australia you are looking at over AUD300


Yes! you're right, the Hoya super pro 1 HMC thin 3mm or B&W thin, double side thread, costs you nearly the price of the 18-70
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Postby huynhie on Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:22 pm

Slaggie

Just notice you are from Canada,

here is a link to give you an idea on prices

www.bwfilter.com
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Re: circular polarizer

Postby fozzie on Wed Feb 09, 2005 1:17 pm

Slaggie (Geo),

Slaggie wrote:In reading a photographers website I saw this comment about Nikon autofocus cameras having trouble with linear polarizers. Nikon uses a partial mirror system for autofocus plus matrix and spot metering . The article claims that under certain lighting conditions, linear polarizers interfere with these automatic systems. The results of interference are, slower than normal focusing, incorrect focusing, and/or incorrect exposure.The fix is to use a Nikon circular polarizer. Now; I like to use a polarizer and am wondering about the effect of the filter on a photo. You cant rotate the filter to get the effect you want, bummer. I suppose these Nikon filters are quite expensive, more bummer.
Does this really have these effects? Or does everybody already know this and I am only now seeing this as this will be my first Nikon?
Geo. :-?


Download this handbook (pdf) re B+W Filters, and this will also assist you with additional information:

http://www.schneideroptics.com/filters/ ... k_Full.pdf BTW: BHphotovideo stock B+W filters:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/control ... &image.y=5


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Postby Slaggie on Wed Feb 09, 2005 1:54 pm

Ouch! Another lens or a polarizer. Think another lens wins! Kinda sad that I have to give up a polariser though. Geo. :(
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Postby Mj on Wed Feb 09, 2005 3:47 pm

Slaggie... Birddog has pointed out that some CP filters are indeed expensive... however you don't need to buy a rolls royce to get a car !!!
(mind you there are some cars that I wouldn't recommend either).
I decided to get the Cokin setup which allows me to use the same filters on different lens thread sizes, and the cost is not all that great. Whist I am sure that the top end products perform very well, I have not yet experienced any siginificant problem with the Cokin CP filter either.

Don't take this post as a recommendation for Cokin... it has it's pro's and cons as many here have already discussed... just giving you the idea that there are a number of cost effective options.

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Postby birddog114 on Wed Feb 09, 2005 4:12 pm

Mj wrote:Slaggie... Birddog has pointed out that some CP filters are indeed expensive... however you don't need to buy a rolls royce to get a car !!!
(mind you there are some cars that I wouldn't recommend either).
I decided to get the Cokin setup which allows me to use the same filters on different lens thread sizes, and the cost is not all that great. Whist I am sure that the top end products perform very well, I have not yet experienced any siginificant problem with the Cokin CP filter either.

Don't take this post as a recommendation for Cokin... it has it's pro's and cons as many here have already discussed... just giving you the idea that there are a number of cost effective options.

Michael.


Do you know that now Cokin manufactures the round filter with thread also?
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Postby dooda on Wed Feb 09, 2005 4:15 pm

Slaggie,

Get a polarizer, they are cost effective for the results that they give, plus they are the one filter that you can't duplicate in PS.

I got mine at Lens and Shutter for about $60 Canadian in Vancouver. Not sure if there is a Lens and Shutter in Victoria, but they seem to have the best prices here in Vancouver. Have you lived in Victoria long?

WELCOME!!! Bytheway. I'm one of a couple of resident Canadians that visit this forum now and I've learned a ton since I logged on for the first time. Hope you stick around. We might have to call for a North American D70 forum meet in Victoria, probably the prettiest town in Canada (not to mention the coolest and most colourful etc etc) man I love it there. Use to head over and see my favorite band Nomeansno in High School (always loved the song "Victoria" by the Hanson Brothers as well). Be sure to post some pics. This is the best place to learn! [/i]
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Postby Mj on Wed Feb 09, 2005 4:23 pm

Birddog114 wrote:Do you know that now Cokin manufactures the round filter with thread also?


Yep... seen that on their site... not sure of the value or quality proposition on those products that would set them apart from hoya, b&w etc etc.
For my current usage the cokin filter system works ok for me and can use a single CP and ND filter set (probably the only ones I'd bother with) on all my lens.
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Postby birddog114 on Wed Feb 09, 2005 4:28 pm

Mj wrote:
Birddog114 wrote:Do you know that now Cokin manufactures the round filter with thread also?


Yep... seen that on their site... not sure of the value or quality proposition on those products that would set them apart from hoya, b&w etc etc.
For my current usage the cokin filter system works ok for me and can use a single CP and ND filter set (probably the only ones I'd bother with) on all my lens.


Why Cokin switch to the round filter now? instead of keeping their traditional style? I say 100 people buy filter for their lens, only 5 buy Cokin square type filter, and 95 go to the round style. f they're good enough with many reasons, people will buy Cokin instead of the round styles
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Postby dooda on Wed Feb 09, 2005 4:33 pm

They should stick with what they're known for. No point in competing in the circular threaded market. You buy a cokin so you can stack filters and not get vignetting, and for ND's and ND Grad etc.
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Postby huynhie on Wed Feb 09, 2005 4:37 pm

You will still get vignetting with Cokin filters on a wide angle lens, hense the reason I why I cut the first two filter slots off with a hack saw.

I do have to admit that using graduated filter are much easier on a Cokin system
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Postby Mj on Wed Feb 09, 2005 4:53 pm

Birddog... pros and cons with both options as I pointed out before... outa the 100 I doubt many have made much of an educated decision but bought whatever the salesguy puts in front of them... not sure therefore whether any stats like that bear any relevance to quality etc. I think Cokin have a range of standard filters through acquisition and it's often done that a company offers a number of alternatives to round out a product range... for every person that will buy a pyramid there will be others who would buy a cube if you had one... so offer both!!!
Also true that if you offered a CPL in the market for $2000 you'd find some that would swear that they are better... all part of the marketing game... for the moment I have the cokin system, and whilst it has it's issues, it is doing what I wish outa it for the present.
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Postby birddog114 on Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:03 pm

Mj wrote:Birddog... pros and cons with both options as I pointed out before... outa the 100 I doubt many have made much of an educated decision but bought whatever the salesguy puts in front of them... not sure therefore whether any stats like that bear any relevance to quality etc. I think Cokin have a range of standard filters through acquisition and it's often done that a company offers a number of alternatives to round out a product range... for every person that will buy a pyramid there will be others who would buy a cube if you had one... so offer both!!!
Also true that if you offered a CPL in the market for $2000 you'd find some that would swear that they are better... all part of the marketing game... for the moment I have the cokin system, and whilst it has it's issues, it is doing what I wish outa it for the present.


I doubt Thom Hogan, Peter iNova, Ron Zenich or Moose are using Cokin in their system and hardly see any PJs or war correspondence has the Cokin in their bag, the sales guy can sell anything they put in front of the newbies but not in front of those abovementioned Pro Photogs.

And in photography field, I learned from them and respect them a lot in their works and supports, but never heard of their recommendation anyone in using Cokin filters system and IMHO they well made their own educated decision prior to use the round styles of filter :wink:

If you have a chance to attend one of the NPA meet or at some events in the US, you'll be surprised how many photogs in NPA have their Cokin filters, and I believed these guy won't buy anything which the sales guy put in front of them.
Last edited by birddog114 on Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby huynhie on Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:09 pm

What does NPA stand for?

I look up in yahoo and got the the national pig association :D
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Postby birddog114 on Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:15 pm

huynhie wrote:What does NPA stand for?

I look up in yahoo and got the the national pig association :D


NPA (Nikon Proffessional Association), if you're member of this org. you may be able to receive the first batch of gear from Nikon prior to release to public, Your camera return for service with Nikon, you'll get 1st priority for the service dept. to look at it same as repair and replacemnet.
you may request an loan unit of camera at the event where NPA has stand to shoot, or NPA team will clean CCD for you on the spot at the events
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Postby Slaggie on Thu Feb 10, 2005 5:29 am

Hi Dooda, too bad there is a $45 ferry ride each way between us. Was born here in Victoria. Yep we have Lens & shutter, Blacks, and of course London Drugs sells the D70 as well. London Drugs D70 kit price is 1549.98 with lens. The other shops are at about the same price.
If you get over here sometime send email and maybe we can get together. Ill do the same if I go to the big city.
Cokin filters; I have often thought of going to them for a controllable graduated filter. If a square, circular polarizer is used in the Cokin holder, is the position of the filter critical, like does the exact center of the filter have to match the center of the lens. I dont know diddlysquat about circular polarizers. Geo. :)
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Postby dooda on Thu Feb 10, 2005 5:51 am

Not entirely sure Slaggie. I don't have the circular on cokin as I like to have it threaded on so I can whip it out and shoot without having the big cokin setup. I like LEns and Shutter for the service and selection. London Drugs tends not to have stuff in and it is pricier. Lens and Shutters prices are competitive.

And yes I can come by and you can check out the cokin setup I have. There's no other way to do a ND Grad IMO. That would be great. Again Victoria is the best.
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